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Jeremiah Collins and Johanna Whelan Glanworth

CorkGlanworth (Cork)

I am trying to find my mother's great Grandmother Bridget Collins family lineage.

Bridget Collins was born to Jeremiah Collins and Johanna Whelan, 1867 and baptised

6 April, 1867, Glanworth and Ballindangan, Cork, Ireland. 

She married Jeremiah O'Brien in 1902 in New Zealand. Jeremiah O'Brien was born to a Daniel O'Brien and Margaret Meagher, Tipperary. They ran a very samll pub called The Central Hotel in the early 1900's that was also used as a family dwelling. 

Bridget and Jeremiah had four children during their marriage. She died on 8 June 1927 in Thames, Waikato, at the age of 60, and was buried in Coromandel, Waikato, New Zealand alongside her husband Jeremiah O'Brien (1863-1917).

We know very little about her parents lineage and we would be very appreciative of some help, as we have come to a dead end.

Thank you for your time,

Carrie

Carrie Connolly

15 replies

Carrie,

Info from RootsIreland

Jeremiah and Johanna had at least 7 children born in Glanworth- Thomas 1861, James 1862, John 1863, Johanna 1865, Bridget 1867, Mary 1868, and Margaret 1870

Date of Marriage:20-Apr-1860  

Parish / District:GLANWORTHCounty:Co. Cork

HusbandWife

Name:JeremiahCollinsJohannaWhelan

Address:

Denomination:Roman CatholicRoman Catholic

Occupation:

Age:

Status:

Husband's FatherWife's Father

Name:CollinsWhelan

Address:

Denomination:

Occupation:

Husband's MotherWife's Mother

Name:

Address:

Denomination:

Occupation:

Witness 1Witness 2

Name:JamesWhelanEugeneSullivan

Address:

Notes:

PRIEST: REVD STEPHANE MURPHY E

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

Maybe Jeremiah's death record?

7264724.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie)

Regards- Mary

 

 

mtvrdk@gmail.com

MaryTV you are a star. I can't thank you enough for the help. I have hit a big block in the road.

I had discovered that there was two possible Mary's and a possible Johana. To find more siblings gets me very excited! This certificate certainly looks right. Jeremiah died 1872, this seems fitting... I can't wait to see what else can be found, now I have a little bit more detail. They are a rather hard bunch to track down that's for sure!

I would ideally love to get in contact with a local who knows about the local history of Glanworth, who may have memories of our family. It would be an absolute dream to find anything related to both the Collins and the Whelans. 

 

Carrie Connolly

Carrie-

You might try contacting the parish priest to find more info on your family. There are two churches one Glanworth and the other Ballindangan. My 2nd great grandparents (Clifford/ Murphy) lived in Cloughleafin, Glanworth, Cork and went to the church in Ballindangan.

Margaret was married in 1898 to William Barret. Not sure why they don't have deceased next to her father's name. In 1901, Margaret and family were living with her mother Hannah (Johanna). Johanna died in 1918.

5797604.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie)

4425821.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie)

From Ancestry

NameHannah Collins

GenderFemale

Marital StatusWidow

Age58

Birth Dateabt 1843

Birth PlaceCo Cork

Residence Date31 Mar 1901

House Number21

Residence PlaceGlanworth, Glanworth West, Cork, Ireland

Relation to HeadHead of Family (Head)

OccupationShop Keeper

ReligionR Catholic

Language SpokenIrish and English

LiteracyRead and write

Household Members (Name)AgeRelationship

Hannah Collins58Head of Family (Head)

Margaret Barrett28Daughter

William Barrett29Son in Law (Son-in-law)

Hannah Barrett

URLhttp://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Cork/Glanworth_West/Gl…

 

Regards- Mary

mtvrdk@gmail.com

Carrie,

Per Irishgenealogy, Margaret Barrett died in 1920 in Glanworth. Still trying to find in 1911 census.

4406879.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie)

mtvrdk@gmail.com

Mary,

I am crying tears of joy. A death date for our dearest ancestor Johanna (Hannah)!? I wonder what happened to Jeremiah and the other children? I feel a great sense of connection to the our Collins and Whelan relatives from Glanworth for some strange reason. 

I reached out to a lovely man Patrick Murphy via ancestry, who had been to Glanworth several times, who lives in the US. He has a connection to Glanworth as his great grandfather also came from the town. He had researched the Barrett family and this is how I managed to find the our Collins family. He didn't know much about the Collins, but was able to show me the census with Hannah living alongside her daughter and her husband William Barret, but this is as far as we got. I have also been trying to get a hold of another person who shares a very small percentage of DNA with my mother on ancestry to no avail. I would love to find as many descendants of Jeremiah, Johanna and Bridget as possible, that may still be living today. This is what led me to Irelandxo.

What a wonderful organisation this is! Having the records in front of me, I feel a great sense of relief. I find researching quite difficult at the best of times, your help has been tremendously helpful.I shall contact the Parish priest via email, this may give us more leads. Here is hoping we dig up some more on our dear family from Glanworth! I would give anything to be able to make it to Ireland one day. It certainly is a long way to go from little ole New Zealand!

Thank you Mary :) 

Carrie Connolly

Carrie,

To add a bit to what Mary said.

I could find no Jeremiah Collins in Glanworth in the Griffith’s Valuation, although there were a number of people with the Collins name. It is possible that Jeremiah’s father was alive and that it was his father that had the lease on the land. Jeremiah’s first child was Thomas and according to naming traditions in Ireland, it is possible that Jeremiah’s father was Thomas Collins. In the Grifith’s Valuation there was only one Thomas Collins who lived in Sandville townland in Glanworth.  There are also records for Thomas Collins in Sandville in the House and Tenure books of 1847/1849 (see this link) http://census.nationalarchives.ie/search/vob/results.jsp?surname=collins&firstname=&year_from=&year_to=&dd_dd=&dd_mm=&dd_yyyy=&book=&county=&barony=&parish=glanworth&townland=&last_name_other_or_lessor=&first_name_other_or_lessor=&search=Search.

There was also Darby Collins in Sandville in the Tithe Applotment Books of 1825 (see this link http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?surname=&firstname=&county=Cork&townland=Sandville&parish=Glanworth&search=Search&sort=&pageSize=&pager.offset=10).

Nothing definitive in this, but it may lead to something.

In Glanworth recording of marriages and baptisms began in 1836. I found no Jeremiah Collins baptised after 1836.

The headstone inscriptions for Glanworth old graveyard have been transcribed. I hope to get a look at them during this week and I will let you know if I find any reference to Jeremiah.

Let me know if Sandville rings any bells and I can see if there are any Collins family there.

Best wishes, Kieran

Kieran Jordan, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Thank you Kieran, Thank you so very much for your dedication in helping me find my roots!

I can't say that anything rings a bell unfortunately... I really do not have a lot to go on. The only information I have is within my message above. Really the only thing I know for certain is Jeremiah Collins married Johanna (Hannah) Whelan and that they had a 7 children between them. One of which is our Bridget Collins born 1867. I understand it isn't much to go on.

The other information such as birth and death etc were found on ancestry from a member PatraigMurphy1 who had similar names. There is no DNA match to padraighmurphy to speak of, only that he had researched the Bennetts for his tree and one of the Bennetts married a Mary Collins, who I believe was our Bridget's sister. Here is the link to his tree...

https://www.ancestry.com.au/family-tree/tree/9372341/family?cfpid=13247…

I believe from the records graciously given to me above by Mary match our family. From what I can see there seemed to be a history of shopkeepers/publicans among the Collins. Jeremiah may have owned a combined shop/licensed alcohol premise. Bridget Collins also married a Jeremiah O'Brien in New Zealand whom also came from a line of Hotel owners/publicans. Bridget and Jeremiah got sponsored by Jeremiah's family members and opened up a small Hotel/Pub in the mining town of Thames, Coromandel, New Zealand. So I think they may have met each other in New Zealand, through this shared common occupation somehow...

I found a Milo Larsen as a close DNA match, but it confused me as he has both O'Brien's and Collins on his tree, however he does have a Thomas Collins and as you mentioned above Jeremiah's father could be a Thomas? I have also picked up the name John Collins on DNA matches family tree albeit 4th-6th cousins with percentages once again quite well removed. John seems to be a family name passed down also.

Milo Larsen

4th – 6th Cousin | Maternal side

https://www.ancestry.com.au/discoveryui-matches/compare/82FA8DD9-9E9C-4…

My wish is to find Bridget's parents and also find how it was that she came to settle in New Zealand. 

I am also having a wee problem finding Johanna Whelan's family. I really am not certain where her lineage came from within Ireland. I only have her death from which I found thanks to Mary's research. No doubt she comes from Cork, somewhere as this is where she was buried. However she could have been born somewhere else, who knows...

I have no close DNA matches to Jeremiah Collins or Johanna Whelan to go on. I do however have one person, but she is extended family with a tiny percent of DNA shared. 

 Nora McCarthy

4th – 6th Cousin | Maternal side

https://www.ancestry.com.au/discoveryui-matches/compare/82fa8dd9-9e9c-4…

I have unfortunately not had a reply after reaching out to her on ancestry. She has a Thomas and a James Whelan, who may possibly relate somehow to our Johanna, I am just not quite clued up enough to work it out, haha. At one stage I came across a will and testament linked to Pierce and Thomas Whelan that had a Hannah Collins as a beneficiary, but lost this and can not find it again. I think maybe Hannah was quite close to this Thomas and Pierce, if I have the right family...

I will attach a screenshot of Nora's and Milo and Padraigmurphy1's tree as this may help?

I think maybe a person such as yourself or Mary may have more of an idea on how one could piece all of it together ;) 

Well that's all for now. My brain feels sore. 

Once again, a heart felt thank you to all that are helping to find the mystery of our Collins and Whelans! 

Carrie Connolly

Carrie,

Johanna, per the 1901 census, was born in Cork. After you mentioned Thomas and Pierce, I did some more research and found the following information on RootsIreland that may be Johanna's family??

A Thomas Whelan and Mary Magner were married in Killavullen, Cork, (southwest of Glanworth) in 1852. They had a daughter Ellen there in 1853. The next recorded births were in Glanworth in 1858, twins- Pierce and Elizabeth. Honora Whelan was Pierce's sponsor.

 

Regards- Mary

mtvrdk@gmail.com

Carrie,

 I found the will you mentioned for Pierce Whelan. Hopefully it shows up below. He died in 1884 in Ballyclough, Cork. Born about 1820. He was a widower.

4807480.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie)

He leaves belongings to Thomas his brother, Hannah Collins his sister, and Pierce Whelan his nephew, son of Thomas.

 

mtvrdk@gmail.com

Sorry document did not show up. This is probably Pierce's wedding record from RootsIreland. Margaret died in 1882.

Date of Marriage:17-Feb-1855  

Parish / District:KILWORTHCounty:Co. Cork

HusbandWife

Name:PierceWhilanMargaretClancy

Address:

Denomination:Roman CatholicRoman Catholic

Occupation:

Age:

Status:

Husband's FatherWife's Father

Name:WhilanClancy

Address:

Denomination:

Occupation:

Husband's MotherWife's Mother

Name:

Address:

Denomination:

Occupation:

Witness 1Witness 2

Name:MorganClancyJamesWhilan

Address:

Notes:

PRIEST: DANIEL DILWORTH E

mtvrdk@gmail.com

In 1911 a Pierce Whelan is living in Ballyclogh, Glanworth. I am not sure if this is the same townland I mentioned above?? Could be the nephew?

Residents of a house 3 in Ballyclogh (Glanworth East, Cork)

Show all information

WhelanPierce 38 Male Head of Family Roman Catholic Co Cork Farmer Read and write Single

MahonyMary45FemaleServantRoman CatholicCo CorkDomestic Servant (Cook)Read and writeIrish and EnglishWidow

mtvrdk@gmail.com

Carrie,

There are no headstones to any Collins family in the book on headstone transcriptions for Glanworth old graveyard. Unfortunately, at this stage I can’t offer anything else on the Collins family.

I had better luck with the Whelan name. I located the probate for the will you mentioned (see this link: http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/reels/cwa/005014899/005014899_00442.pdf). Pierce Whelan of Ballyclough died in 1884 and Thomas Whelan was the sole executor.  Mary says she found the will and it states that he left belongings to his sister Hannah Collins. That is great as you can say that Pierce and Hannah were brother and sister. So, I would think that you have found the right family.

According to Griffith’s Valuation, James Whelan had a farm at Ballintantassig, Glanworth. Ballykenley Stud is the current building where James lived.  I will call there in the next few weeks and see if the Whelan family are still there and if there are any of the family interested in family history.

James Whelan is also listed in the same townland in the Valuation Office house and tenure books in 1847 and 1849, respectively (see this link: http://census.nationalarchives.ie/search/vob/results.jsp?surname=whelan&firstname=james&year_from=&year_to=&dd_dd=&dd_mm=&dd_yyyy=&book=&county=Cork&barony=&parish=glanworth&townland=&last_name_other_or_lessor=&first_name_other_or_lessor=&search=Search). He is also listed in the Tithe Applotment Books of 1825 (see this link: http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?county=Cork&parish=Glanworth&townland=Ballintotesig&search=Search).

I think that Pierce is connected to the above James as there is a headstone in the Glanworth graveyard book that reads as follows:

Erected by Thomas Whelan, Ballintotesig, in memory of his father James Whelan who died December 28 1881 aged 90 years. His brother Pierce died September 17 1881 aged 61 years. His two children Bridget & Margaret both died young and his sister Ellen died May 28 1881 aged 55 years.

I know the headstone book says 1881, but I think that this is either an error in transcription or an error by the stonemason. The Civil Record for Pierce says he died in 1884 as does the probate. I am happy that the Pierce of 1881 and 1884 are the same person. I will visit the grave in Glanworth and see where the error was.

Thomas married Mary Nunan of Fermoy in 1865 when he was aged 30. (I don't think that the marriage record to Margaret Clancy is the correct one, as the family can be found in the 1901 census where Mary was the wife.) His daughter Margaret died in 1874 aged 4 and Bridget in 1874 aged 1. Thomas died in 1910. His age is different in all the documents. He was 65 when he died in 1910 and 65 in the 1901 census. So it is a bit difficult to say when he was born!

According to the 1901 census (see this link: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Cork/Kilphelan/Ballintantassig/1152947/)

Thomas and Mary had children James, Pierce, Maria, Katie, Thomas and John. They also had Margaret and Bridget, both of whom died. The census records were recorded in District Electoral Divisions (DED). The townland where the Whelans lived was Ballintantassig in the DED of Kilphelan in County Cork.

Jeremiah and Johanna were married in Glanworth. Generally, a marriage took place in the bride’s home parish, so I suspect that Johanna was from Glanworth, which she appears to be in the above.

In summary, James Whelan was born in 1791, Pierce was born in 1823, Ellen was born in 1826 and Thomas was born in maybe 1835. I don’t know when any other children were born. Dates of birth are a bit unreliable, but Hannah being mentioned in the will as a sister, confirms the issue. The headstone record tells alot and when combined with the will 'ties up' the situation. 

In the next few weeks I will get to Ballykenly and Glanworth and will let you know what I find.

Best wishes, Kieran

Kieran Jordan, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Kieran and Mary,

Is it my birthday!? What a bingo this is. I have to pinch myself! I can't wait for my mother to come back from her holiday to find this. I really don't know what to say. Oh my, I've come over all emotional.  More information to add to this...? it'll feel like christmas, haha. My deepest appreciation to you and all who help out find my dear family. God bless! 🙏

Carrie Connolly

Carrie,

I visited the graveyard in Glanworth today. The headstone actually says 1881. So I guess the stonemason made an error or was told the wrong year. I think that 1884 was the date of death for Pierce. I also visited Ballykenly House. Unfortunately, Whelans no longer live there. Tom Whelan died a few years ago. He had a few daughters and I will try to locate them. There must be someone around as the grave is very well kept (see attached).

Best wishes, Kieran

Kieran Jordan, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Good afternoon Kieran,

I did wonder if Johanna was the daughter of one of the James? What a beautiful headstone they have! I think you are right, it certainly looks as though somebody is looking after it so nicely. 

I am so glad that we are on the right track anyway. Thank you x 1 million trillion. I don't think I would be so close without you and Mary.

I did find a Ballykenly Stud online. It looks as though somebody named Marie Whelan owns it? Maybe she could be related to our Whelans somehow? 

Warm regards,

Carrie and Linda X

Carrie Connolly

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