Samuel Bray and Patrick Bray

Eamonn:

Thank you so much for your advice and tips. It is so helpful to find someone who is familiar with the area and your suggestions are most appreciated. It is especially interesting what you say regarding Birr being a military town. I have often wondered if the reason I can not find a birth record for my Patrick (1839) is that he was born abroad. My Patrick was stationed in India for much of his military career and my grandfather Samuel was born there. Patrick had at least 3 children while in India, two of which are burried there as well as his wife Margaret.

While both the 1817 and 1819 are certainly possibilities as Patrick 1939's father based on locations etc., my only concerns would be that my Patrick's 1864 marriage record in Salford, Lancashire England lists his father's profession as "General Laborer" and that at least the 1819 Patrick Bray was stilll engaged with the 77th Foot through the 1870s. I haven't found anything further on Patrick 1817. Also of slight concern is that neither Patrick 1817 nor Patrick 1819 have parents with future family forenames that I've yet discovered.

Bray(6) -- I thought this was my Patrick for some time until I uncovered his marriage license and his sister's marriage record both listing their father as Patrick. It's very likely this could be a cousin, however.

Bray(7) -- I feel very strongly that this is a sibling to my Patrick and Samuel is also one of Patrick's son's names. I suspect that the father of my Patrick (1839) married a Mary Kenna on 1 Nov 1836 in Maryborough, so the "Mary n/r" could be her. Of note, the link from rootsireland.ie to Samuel's actual parish record does not appear to display any Samuel Bray on the page, so I can't verify the actual index entry.

Bray(8) -- Agreed. Related family some how. Perhaps cousins.

I have not tracked any sons in the Navy or to Australia, but hints of that nature do keep popping up on Ancestry. At first glance, they do not apear to match up, but I haven't explored too far.

Bray(1) -- Is intriguing, however, I think there's a more likely William born Will Bray to Patt Bray and Mary Kenna, baptized 3 July 1847 in Camross. I think this is one of my Patrick (1839)'s brothers perhaps.

I looked at the Vail fam.tree. I haven't sorted it out yet, but I've previously come across a problem with this Samuel/Mary family. There seem to be to Samuel Bray/wife Mary families in this part of england with very similary named and aged children: one Samuel born in Ireland and one Samuel born in Dukinfield Cheshire England. One emmigrates to the America's and one stays in England...or something else is going on that I don't yet understand. One of them, though, I believe is Bray(1). In either regard, I think the tree has Samuel's mother Mary Kelly listed in error. It is taken from the Marriage Record incorrectly. Mary Kelly is the spouse, not the mother. Interestingly, my Patrick's death record Informant is a sister, Mary Ann Simmonds. Mary Ann was first married to a Patrick Kelly with a father of Thomas Kelly. Samuel of Ireland is married to a Mary Kelly, who's father is also a Thomas Kelly. I think we have a brother and sister Bray marrying a brother and sister Kelly.

Also of note, two years prior to my Patrick's death, the 1881 Bradford Yorkshire census shows his sister Mary Ann Simmonds and her mother Mary living in the same house. Mary Ann is noted as being born in Tiperary (Brit Subj), Ireland -- maybe while father Patrick was stationed there -- and mother Mary is noted as being born in Queens County Marlbow (Brit Subj), Ireland -- which I assume is intended to be Maryborough?

I'm sure that's more detail than you ever wanted to know about the Bray family ;-). Thank you for your time and consideration. If any other tips or clues just out at you, I am most interested. This Bray family has been challenging every step of the way.

Hi, I don’t know if this will help or confuse you more.  My great great grandmother was Elizabeth Bray of Castletown Mountrath area but in the Parish records for her marriage it is recorded as Brophy.  My grandfather always said it was spelt Bray but pronounced Brophy.  Elizabeth  was born in Castletown Laois and her parents were Anna Bloomer and James Bray (Brophy).  Her parents married in 1807 in Castletown but I have never been able to find a record of any baptisms in Ireland.  I have been told that the baptismal records for Camross and Castletown interchange as the Parish was moved yet there is a period between 1807 and 1840 where there appear to be large gaps.  Elizabeth married Patrick Delany of Castletown but again, no record but fortunately their children’s baptisms feature in Castletown records. Castletown, Camross and Mountrath are so very close together and I know Elizabeth attended schooling in Mountrath.   Elizabeth and her adult children moved to New Zealand in the 1860’s. I suspect we may be distant cousins, I have an account on Ancestry with my DNA.  Anna Bloomer, her mother, was originally a Quaker who married a Papist James Bray.

I am descended from the Bray family of Durrow Parish, Queen's County.  The earliest record I have of my ancestors from there is a John Bray, born there in 1762.  He appears to have had an uncle who was with the church called Rev. Thomas Bray born about 1730.  John Bray enlisted in the ranks of the 4th Horse, which was later renamed the Dragood Guards.  He spent quite a lot of time living in Dublin.  His wife was Peggy Nugent.  His son was Lt. Col. Edward William Bray born 1787 in Londford, christened in the Catholic church at Westmeath.  Edward was married to Belinda Murray, possibly born in Dublin - but needs a record.  Perhaps these people are of the same Bray family?