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Odd Census Document

I have a few questions regarding this census document....I am interested in knowing it's purpose and whether someone who emigrated to America (namely James and Catherine in 1844) would be noted on this census if they indeed left for another country. I am unsure of the census date because there appear to be multiple dates listed. Also, are Catherine Baxter and Catherine Mulvey the same person or is this merely a relation? I am additionally curious about the numerous figures littering the page and what they could possibly mean. Any interpretation is appreciated. Thanks.

vangordenkj@gm…

18 replies

It looks like a form which was completed as part of an application (on 29 September 1921), probably for an old-age pension.  I would guess that the applicant, Catherine Mulvey, was living with Catherine Baxter when she filed the application, and thus used her address on the form.

When people filed such applications, they often proved their age by reference to an official census in which they had been listed, in this case back in 1851.   This was necessary, because people often had no other proof of their birth.  Since most of the pre-1901 census records were later destroyed, such pension applications can be a good way of establishing now-lost information.

The notations on the form appear to be ones made by the person(s) evaluating the application, in this case reflecting what was found in the census record.

As to Catherine appearing in the census record, the note near the end of the document seems to say that she did not appear, which would make sense if she had emigrated before 1851.  I can't explain why Catherine would be applying for a pension in that case, unless she had later returned to Ireland.

kevin45sf@yahoo.com

The Old Age Pension was introduced in the UK & Ireland in 1909. To qualify you had to be 70 or over. Proof of age was required. However since birth certificates were only introduced in Ireland in 1864 (in contrast to 1837 in England), many applicants couldn’t produce one. So in Ireland other documents were acceptable, eg baptismal certificates, marriage certificates (if they established your age satisfactorily) and military discharge documents which normally contained the person's age. However if you had none of those, another approach was to check the 1851 (and sometimes the 1841) census. Obviously if a pension applicant in say 1917 was 4 or older in the 1851 census, then they’d be over 70 and so eligible.  So there was a system whereby applicants without proof of age could complete a form stating where they were living (or thought they were living) in 1851, and where relevant, in 1841. This information would then be sent to the Public Record Office in Dublin and checked against the censuses.  If their family was found in the relevant census and the age accurate, then they’d get their pension. 

The pension was non-contributory, with the cost being borne by taxpayers generally. It was enacted in 1908 and was to pay a weekly pension of 5s a week (7s 6d for married couples) with effect from 1 January 1909. The level of benefit was deliberately set low to encourage workers to go on making their own provision for retirement. In order to be eligible, claimants had to have an income less than £31. 10s. a year, and also had to pass a 'character test'; only those with a 'good character' could receive the pensions. Claimants also had to have been resident in Great Britain and Ireland for at least twenty years to be eligible, and those who had not worked habitually were also not eligible.

In the document you have found Catherine Mulvey was applying for a pension in September 1921 (indicating she had probably recently reached 70). She told the authorities that in 1851 she believed she was living in one of 3 townlands ie Arderry, Drumlea or Drumreilly. She gives her parents' names. The clerk in Dublin evidently searched the 1851 census (taken 30th March 1851) and found an entry to confirm Catherine’s information. It is not clear in which of the 3 townlands the family were living. The notes (as I read them) indicate Catherine's parents married in 1840. In addition to finding Catherine in the 1851 census, there were siblings Owen, Jane, Margaret, Mary, Ann & James. Plus Thomas who had died. (The 1841 & 1851 censuses asked for details of family members who had died or were not at home on census night. Information dropped after those 2 censuses). Some of the other notes are to do with the search fee. Catherine appears to have sent 3 shillings (3/=) but the appropriate fee was only 2/6 ie 2 shillings and sixpence. Or half a crown, as I recall it. So she was due a refund of 6d (sixpence), which was sent on 30.9.1920.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Thank you so much for your response. It was extremely informative and helped me verify (based upon the timeline) that this is not the individual I was searching for. I am guessing this Catherine became Catherine Baxter due to marriage? Or was Catherine Baxter the clerk? Again, I so appreciate your assistance. 

vangordenkj@gm…

Thanks!! You are the best. Even if you have broken my heart by confirming that I'm back at square one lol. 

vangordenkj@gm…

For your part, you might be interested to know that it appears that the rest of the family (aside from James and Catherine perished in a shipwreck.)  Crazy.

vangordenkj@gm…

Those deaths are very sad. 

If you want our help tracing your family, please post what you know about them, in particular their names, approximate years of birth, occupations, etc and where they may have come from and we’ll see if we can help you.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Unfortunately, I'm working on a 15 year mystery for a James Mulvey Born in the year 1820 Leitrim, Ireland. He immigrated to America at some point and died on July 27, 1858 Lynchburg, Virginia but was buried in Windsor Locks, Connecticut. He had three sisters: Catherine, Jane and Mary who allegedly lived in Springfield, Massachusettes but were also born in Leitrim, Ireland. That is the extent of my knowledge. I have done many hours of internet research and have posted on various forums in an attempt to piece together this mystery but have failed. 

My thread here on reddit, and then here, essentially explains the entire situation in depth. I have never been able to find anything conclusive on him or his siblings aside from the "heirs wanted" which I uploaded here. 

 

Here is an image of the gravestone that started it all....He is not buried with any family and is in an isolated portion of the cemetery that is away from other gravestones with the mysterious "may the lord have mercy on his soul" enscribed...

vangordenkj@gm…

I think you have a bit of a task ahead of you. You will probably know there are gaps in Irish records, to put it mildly. In Co Leitrim in the 1800s few parishes kept records of births or marriages till the mid 1800s.  I have attached a link to a map of all 26 RC parishes in the county. I didn’t check them all but I couldn’t find any with baptisms for c 1820 (when your James Mulvey was born).  So you are probably not going to find any record of his birth.

https://www.johngrenham.com/browse/counties/rcmaps/leitrimrc.php#maps/

I can see that no record seems to exist of his death in the US.  However his siblings are known. Are there any marriage or death records that name their parents, and their occupations? If so, we might be able to search for them in Irish records. There are records of farmers around 1830 called the tithe applotment records plus Griffiths Valuation 1848 – 1863, which contains more detailed records of the population. And from 1864 onwards there are statutory death records (Vital records).

In the 1901 census of Leitrim there were 402 named Mulvey. That may give you an idea of how common the name was in the county.

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

I appreciate the link. I'll take a look. Unfortunately, there were likewise an infinite amount of Irish immigrants in the US with the last name Mulvey in the mid 1800's so it's been nearly impossible to trace his siblings in any concrete way. Moreover, it's possible that they may have married. I haven't been able to place any of these individuals anywhere. James has no record whatsoever. I was hoping that the census document was a lead and it appeared extremely promising given that it lists all his alleged sisters. It's very disappointing that the timeline simply did not fit.  It's quite the puzzle. If I am someday able to trace his parents or siblings I will let you know. Thanks again.

 

Any theories as to why the poor fellow has "may the lord have mercy on his soul" inscribed on his gravestone and is isolated from other graves? 

vangordenkj@gm…

The isolated location and the inscription both suggest to me that there was something unusual or unfortunate about his death. Perhaps suicide or an execution. Something that crossed my mind is that James is not buried there at all.  The stone is a memorial not a grave marker. It doesn’t say: “Here lies….” It says: “In memory of…” That inscription is quite common here in Ireland when someone is buried elsewhere. They get remembered on a gravestone but they aren’t buried under it.  Sometimes it might say something like "died in New South Wales" but with others the place of burial isn't mentioned at all.

James might have drowned at sea or in battle, or whilst prospecting for gold in the Yukon, and there was either no body to recover or it was not practicable to recover it. Either way it still sounds as though he came to an unfortunate end. However his family clearly remembered him and went to the bother of paying for this memorial which is nice to know.

Not being buried there could of course explain why you can’t find a death certificate for him.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

I pieced together some information today and have reason to believe James' sister may have been Mary Sharky who married James Sharky and had a son John who would have been been around 1843 in Ireland. I am looking for a record confirming this. Her maiden name would be Mulvey.

vangordenkj@gm…

I have long suspected that James is not buried there either. I know transferring the body was a costly and unusual procedure prior to the Civil War whiched occurred in the 1860's. I know it's the first grave I ever encountered where the person was born in one place, died in another and buried in a third location. I appreciate your thoughts. I have long suspected suicide myself. I do wonder if his administrator erected the stone as well. 

vangordenkj@gm…

I had a look at the Irish RC marriage and baptism records on Ancestry but can’t find a marriage between James Sharky & Mary Mulvey nor the baptism of their son John in 1843.  That’s not to say those events didn’t happen but if in Co Leitrim it was probably before records begin. There’s about 26 parishes in Leitrim and only about 11 have records for the 1840s.

If someone died in the 1800s there was no effective way of preserving the body in order to transport it any distance, so local burial was the norm. The British Admiral Nelson was pickled in a barrel of brandy in 1806 to transport his body from Gibraltar to England, for a state funeral. Even then the lid of the barrel blew off en route, due to gases building up inside. It was being guarded by a couple of sailors and they got a bit of a fright as his body bobbed up in front of them.  By the time it got to England the surgeon in charge said the body was so decomposed no-one should view it. Local burial definitely was a better option in my opinion. 

“May the Lord have mercy upon your soul” were the words normally said by a judge when sentencing someone to death in Ireland & Britain, but no doubt it could be used in other circumstances too.  And obviously its use in the US might well be quite different. All the same it’s seems a very sombre epitaph.  I suspect suicide myself.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Thanks for looking it up! I appreciate all your help. It's a shame that the records are so spotty. There's a high probability that I tracked down his one sister so I am attempting to enlist some online assistance in my area as well. I will attach the census document I located just for reference. I have no idea if their marriage would have taken place in Leitrim due to the document not specifying. 

What a story! I know cremation wasn't authorized by the Catholic Church until the 1960's so of course options were limited. 

Those words are likewise said in death sentences over here and generally associated with suicide. It's a sad albeit safe conclusion. I'll always be curious why. 

 

vangordenkj@gm…

My search included all RC parish records in Ireland (not just those for Leitrim) so would have picked up a marriage or baptism in another county.  There are a few parishes where the records exist but are not on-line plus some where the records are illegible, but in the main most of the surviving RC records can be searched on-line.

There were/are Sharkey families in Co Leitrim so it’s quite possible James & Mary met and married there. (And I think that’s very likely). 

I note that James and son John were blacksmiths. That’s a trade that was often handed down through generations. I found several Sharkey families in Leitrim in the 1901 census who were also blacksmiths. I suspect your James & John may be connected to some of them. 

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Leitrim/Lurganboy/Mountainthird/1474280/

James Sharkey married Honor Drum in 1874:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1874/11227/8116031.pdf

His father was another blacksmith also named James Sharkey. 

Here’s the birth of their son John:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1877/03010/2103300.pdf

I found another James Sharkey, blacksmith in the same area:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1879/11081/8055208.pdf

His wife died in 1880:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1883/06353/4822728.pdf

Some more Sharkey blacksmith records:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1894/05977/4699283.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1901/05719/4613663.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05931/4684566.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1887/06214/4777926.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1886/06250/4789614.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1883/06353/4822728.pdf

There were 6 Sharkey deaths around Manorhamilton in the period 1870 – 1900. All were either blacksmiths or a wife or daughter of same.

Another Sharkey marriage where the father was again a blacksmith:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1873/11286/8140398.pdf

Many of these events took place in the parish of Killasnet. Their records start in 1852.  Perhaps that’s where your Sharkey family are from? It’s certainly an area to focus on. And it would fit with the lack of records for James & Mary’s marriage or their son’s baptism in 1843. On the other hand I can’t find any Mulvey households in Killasnet in Griffiths Valuation in 1857. But anyway it’s got to be more than a coincidence that there were all those Sharkey blacksmiths in that area of the county.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

I agree that the coincidence was just too great for there to be Sharkey blacksmiths in that area. I have been searching birth records hoping that Mary and James would note where they were born on the birth certificates for their many children. As of yet, I haven't been able to locate any. The 19th century records birth/christening records are just as sporadic in the US and it's worsened by how nomadic this couple was. (They appeared to have lived in no less than five different places.) They appear to have immigrated through Canada given their second child was born there after John's birth in Ireland. I'm not sure how popular Canada was for an immigration destination in the 1850's. Unfortunately, Canada basically did not keep any records prior to the mid 1860's

 I did find an updated census and it appears two more younger sons entered the blacksmith trade.  Pretty neat. I'll do some browsing and hopefully I can make some further connections. I did cursorily notice a daughter named Honora born to a James Sharkey. They must be related to James Sharkey/Honor given how unusual the name Honor/Honora is. (As far as I know.) I really do appreciate your assistance. You've been a huge help. I'll let you know if I find anything of note. I have so much respect for individuals pursuing their family tree because this isn't for the faint of heart. :)

vangordenkj@gm…

Canada was very popular for many Irish people both as a destination in it’s own right, and also as a transit route to the US.  The US authorities had introduced regulations in the early 1800s intended to reduce over-crowding on what were often described as coffin ships from Britain, Ireland and elsewhere. The consequence of that - very sensible decision - was to push up fares, as fewer passengers could be carried. Canada did not have such stringent rules then and so fares there remained significantly lower. Consequently folk went in large numbers. As you say Canada had almost no passenger arrival records before around 1850, so it’s often impossible to confirm exactly when someone arrived (at least from shipping records anyway).

Irish research is certainly not for the faint of heart. It can be very difficult compared with many other countries. Good luck anyway.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

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