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Henry McGown / McGown

Re the family of Henry McGown / McGowan for whom we have scanty details.

He married Sarah Mark - both of these were dead before 1862 when their son John was married in Newmains, Cambusnethan, Scotland. John was born about 1836 in Co Antrim. No other "concrete" details are known although it is likely that Henry's father was John.

In searching for strawsI have found the followinglocations for Henry McGown / McGowan in various documents:

In the Valuation Office Books event dated 20 May 1832 Barony of Belfast Upper, Parish Shankill,town land of TheTownparks- page 260 LH page- entry numbered 73 in Fall's Road (Belfast). I also found him at 18 Falls Road with a dairyIn Martins Belfast Directorysin 1841-1842, and 1842-1843;and Henderson's new Belfast and Northern Repository for 1843-1844, and 1846-1847. A Mrs McGowan at 21/2 Joy Street is the only possibility listed in Hendersons 1850 Belfast Directory - Mary McCleave was listed at 18 Falls Road.

I have also found him in Griffiths Valuation 1847 - 1864 page 364 in the Parish of Shankill, St George's Ward at 3 Whitehall Court, Townparks with a house and office worth 1 pound 15 shillings. He was the occupier - James McCracken was the lessor.

Another entry for Henry McGowan is given in 1861 (Griffiths Valuation) in the Townland of Ballintoy Demesne, Civil Parish Ballintoy, Barony Clary, Poor Law Union of Ballycastle occupying house, office and garden worth 1 pound -leased fromAlexander McKennan.

I had also found a Henry McGown in the Townland of Ballyknock, Loughguile in the Tithe Applotment Books for 1832.

I would appreciate any help that can be given - the family of John b 1836 migrated to South Otago, New Zealand from Scotland in 1879 and a descendantof his family is still in possession of the farm he settled (a rarity these days).

Many thanks for any help you can give

Helen McGowan,Carterton,New Zealand

Magoos

14 replies

Helen,

Tracing a family from the early 1800s without knowing where they lived can be very difficult. Firstly, what was Henry’s occupation (as per the 1862 Scottish marriage certificate). That might give a clue as to whether he lived in a city like Belfast or a rural location. It can also help decide whether he would be listed in a street directory or Griffiths Valuation.

Have you checked the Scottish censuses for John to see if any gives a more detailed place of birth? Though usually it just says Ireland, sometimes you get more than that. They are on Scotlandspeople.

What denomination was John, do you know?

Quite a lot of people who moved to Scotland from Ireland ended up claiming under the Poor Law system (the equivalent of today’s social welfare system). Where they made such a claim, then their parish of origin in Ireland plus next of kin were usually noted in the files. So you might consider searching the Scottish Poor Law records to see if the family is listed there. The records for the Glasgow area, including Lanarkshire are held in the Mitchell Library in Glasgow. They will do a search for you (for a small fee).

http://www.glasgowlife.org.uk/libraries/the-mitchell-library/archives/collections/poor-law-archives/Pages/default.aspx

 

 

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Hi Elwyn   Thank you for your prompt response, which I will answer in the order you comment. John's mar Iage certificate and any other documents we have uncovered either in Scotland or in NZ all have Co Antrim or Ireland as his birthplace - very helpful! Henry's occupation on that certificate is given as shoemaker, although there is a person who believes he was a farmer at some stage.  It was that document that declared both parents were deceased. Their denomination from Scottish days onwards has been Presbyterian - that said, having read some Irish history I know that is not necessarily so for the family in Northern Ireland. There is a family pattern amongst the descendants of John's 2 sons whereby some are real tightwads (as was the younger son) and others cannot hold onto their money (like the older son). The youngest daughter of the younger son is still alive and describes her father as being so tight with his money it pinched!  I have traced John in Scotland from the 1861 census onwards. He consistently worked for the Coltness Iron and Steel works in Newmains as a furnaceman, as did his father-in-law John Savage (b abt 1816) also from Co Antrim, although he was in Scotland by 1843.  The old chestnut of 1 parent dying when John was young, the possibility he had gone to a relative in Scotland, and one parent maybe going to America has been kept in the back of my mind through all my years of researching this family.....   I had not thought of poor relief in Scotland, so thanks for that tip.  Reagrds Helen

 

 

 

 

 

Magoos

A shoemaker would not normally have any land, so wouldn’t normally appear in the tithes. The folk in the tithes were mostly farmers. A shoemaker could be rural or town based, so no great conclusions to be drawn there.

Perhaps the Poor Law records will give a clue.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

I have Elizabeth McGowan who married Daniel McGonigal in Poor relief Glasgow 1865.

Both Elizabeth parents were dead, but were listes as Charles McGow (Shoemaker) and Sarah Mark

IrelandXO member

Thanks - this may have been a second marriage for Sarah - there is no Charles anywhere in our tree which has all descendants from John McGown/McGowan b abt 1836 in Co Antrim and his wife Elizabeth Savage. William, Henry and John are the consistent recurring names in all branches.....

 

Magoos

Good afternoon from NZ. We have followed up on Elizabeth McGowan and Daniel McGonigal. I have discovered an Irish RC Baptismal record for Elizabeth in 1827 - Down and Armagh is the place given for this baptism. It is unusual (in our eyes) because there is no parent given, only the notation "from Chapel St. covert from Protestantism." she has a sponsor - Mrs Jane Campbell. Is there any way of finding out the significance of any of this information, please? 
Interestingly Elizabeth's death certificate in 1890 gives her parentage as Henry McGowan, shoemaker, deceased (therefore is our Henry). Her mother is given as Mary Jane Grimes - nothing of her has come up in our searches. 
with very much appreciation of whatever help you can give in this puzzle. Helen McGowan

 

 

 

 

 

 

Magoos

What you are almost certainly looking at is an adult baptism. So that Elizabeth was 21 and over in 1827. Parents names are not normally recorded for adult baptisms. People change denomination for many reasons but a common one was marriage.  The RC church in 1827 did not allowed a mixed denomination marriage, so the non RC party would have had to convert, if they wished to marry in an RC church.  Usually the conversion took place about a month before the marriage. Look at the marriages over the next couple of months and see if there’s one for that Elizabeth McGowan.

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

thanks very very much. Once again we Kiwis say Thank you Elwyn. I had wondered about adult baptism then forgot about it. Having followed up the McGonical lead would the 1865 marriage in Scotland be recorded at the time of the birth of one of their children as they were married in Ireland in the late 1850's. Our cousin Marie Dobson has been corresponding with one of their descendants. We both seem to have renewed energy for getting this sorted - perhaps you could blame COVID and our latest lockdown when we have been housebound!

 

 

Magoos

Magoos,

I have struggled a bit with your question. You say: “Having followed up the McGonical lead would the 1865 marriage in Scotland be recorded at the time of the birth of one of their children as they were married in Ireland in the late 1850's.” No matter how I read that I don’t really understand it.  If they married in the 1850s why would they have a marriage in 1865 too? Perhaps I have missed something but could you clarify what you mean?

One piece of useful information regarding Scottish birth certificates is that for the year 1855 only, and then from 1861 onwards, they normally record where and when the parents were married.  So if you are trying to locate an Irish marriage, then seek out any childrens births in Scotland for those years.

 

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Thanks again Elwyn. We too are puzzled by this Scottish marriage, and because it came from a tree on the McGonical side that is not responding to queries, we can only relate it to perhaps the birth of one of their sons (also called Daniel) that year. Regarding the Scottish evidence neither Marie nor I had thought of checking that through, so she will get on to that when her visitors leave sometime this week.

why is it that the obvious gets ignored? Do our brains think they need exercising?!!!

regards and thanks

Helen 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Magoos

Helen,

The 1865 event is a birth for a Daniel McGonegal. According to that certificate, the parents Daniel & Eliza married in Ballymena, Co Antrim in June 1858. Unfortunately there appears to be a gap in Ballymena’s parish records from 23rd May 1858 to 1st August, so there’s no record of the marriage there.  Still you know where the family were living in Ireland.

https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633104#page/43/mode/1up

 

Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘IrelandXO Volunteer

Hello,
My grt-grt grandparnts are Daniel McGonigal and Elizabeth McGowan.
Do u have an email and i can share my family tree?

thanks
Daithi McGonigal

Daithi Mcgonigal

Hi Daithi thanks for your inquiry.

We are cousins of Marie Dobson who has been communicating with you, and we are extremely grateful to you as our tree has been enlarged by yours as we query Elizabeth McGowan's relationship.

Your Elizabeth has indicated on official documents that Sarah Mark is her mother, but has Charles McGowan listed as her father, whereas our descendancy is from Sarah Mark and Henry McGowan (also a shoemaker).
We are grateful for any chink in the the huge brick wall that exists for Protestant Northern Irish families with common names!

Because of that I have a number of "possibility - yet to be proven" people cluttering up the top of the tree, so it looks very messy! It is a private site as our son has control of it and wants to keep it that way for his own personal reasons. If you are on Facebook send me a private message. My husband is a maker of model wooden trucks etc and that features in the header photo.

cheers

Helen McGowan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Magoos

Hi again Daithi Marie Dobson has been talking to me and says you have convincing news about your Elizabeth being Henry's daughter, and therefore sister to our John. Wonderful news. Now a question! Do your Irish contacts know of any way to find out what happened to Henry and Sarah? Our family story is that one of them died, the other went off to America or somewhere, and John went to someone till he was old enough to work - all very vague and no one was sure how old John was at the time, but thought he might have been about 4 or 5. Marie is going to reply to you when she can and give you my email address at the same time - that way we all keep informed about any finds or queries,etc. Hope this is OK with you. Cheers. Helen

 

 

 

Magoos

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